Paul Berthelot: Is Joe Sakic right about Ryan Murray? Is Ryan Murray a #5 defencemen?

Yes and so is 90% of the hockey community

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Yes and so is 90% of the hockey community

Next question
- DDM-Coga

Chicken or pasta for dinner tonight?

Yes and so is 90% of the hockey community

Next question
- DDM-Coga

You beat me to it!

Paul Berthelot: Is Joe Sakic right about Ryan Murray?
Is Ryan Murray a #5 defencemen?
- Paul Berthelot

Alright so what if Murray has been ''playing like a 5th'' , Duschene has probably been playing like a second line centerman.....

As for Sakic , he's up against the clock , the value on Duschene will be eroding (provided he's serious about trading him) to something less then Murray , given he already said no to Hamonic.

Alright so what if Murray has been ''playing like a 5th'' , Duschene has probably been playing like a second line centerman.....

As for Sakic , he's up against the clock , the value on Duschene will be eroding (provided he's serious about trading him) to something less then Murray , given he already said no to Hamonic.

Not if Joe just says frank it and does nothing and Duchene has a great season as he could very well have.

Alright so what if Murray has been ''playing like a 5th'' , Duschene has probably been playing like a second line centerman.....

As for Sakic , he's up against the clock , the value on Duschene will be eroding (provided he's serious about trading him) to something less then Murray , given he already said no to Hamonic.
- Alexzanki

Hamonic is older, slowing down and injury prone...so why would he want him in the first place. A rebuilding team doesnt want a 27-28 year old Dman whos is on the decline.

And His value isnt eroding by the day, thats not how the NHL works....oh he isnt traded this week...next week his value will be less so watch out.

Murray is just a dime a dozen Dman, nothing worng with that. If they wanted a Dman like murray you could just find one in UFA, there is nothing special about him.

Not if Joe just says frank it and does nothing and Duchene has a great season as he could very well have.
- mgriffen

and be 1 year away from UFA which he can talk extentions with teams, upping his value or the very least attractiveness for teams to pull the triggr since teams can talk to him about that.

Its not just Sakic who is gambling here, teams who want Duchene might either be missing the boat or could cost them more the longer the (frank) around

Okay - the numbers don't look good. Sakic also stated that Murray could help them on D. On the Avs Murray would easily be 2nd pair.
Why don't you run the numbers for Duchene and see if he plays to a #2 center ??
It's been stated on many several chat boards that the Avs are over-valuing him too !

Hamonic is older, slowing down and injury prone...so why would he want him in the first place. A rebuilding team doesnt want a 27-28 year old Dman whos is on the decline.

And His value isnt eroding by the day, thats not how the NHL works....oh he isnt traded this week...next week his value will be less so watch out.

Murray is just a dime a dozen Dman, nothing worng with that. If they wanted a Dman like murray you could just find one in UFA, there is nothing special about him.
- DDM-Coga

Murray was stellar with Jones on that off year before Werensky out played him of the first pairing. In 2014 in the playoffs he was , with Wisnewsky , giving the Penguins penalty killers some headaches on the point.

If Jarmo is confident he can get Duschene for Murray ,then that probably tells us the rest of the offers from other teams are next to nothing and that is the value placed on Duschene right now . He's 23 a RFA , perfect for rebuild , keep in mind you're probably getting other assets as well...

Murray was stellar with Jones on that off year before Werensky out played him of the first pairing. In 2014 in the playoffs he was , with Wisnewsky , giving the Penguins penalty killers some headaches on the point.

If Jarmo is confident he can get Duschene for Murray ,then that probably tells us the rest of the offers from other teams are next to nothing and that is the value placed on Duschene right now . He's 23 a RFA , perfect for rebuild , keep in mind you're probably getting other assets as well...
- Alexzanki

I dont hate Murray as a piece but he wouldnt be the Main or even 2nd biggest piece ina deal. Hes just average thats all. Hes exactly like beaulieu who went for a 3rd round pick.

and I would rahter just roll the dice with duchene than seeing him go for an average package

Okay - the numbers don't look good. Sakic also stated that Murray could help them on D. On the Avs Murray would easily be 2nd pair.
Why don't you run the numbers for Duchene and see if he plays to a #2 center ??
It's been stated on many several chat boards that the Avs are over-valuing him too !
- birdie03

The guy is being totally Kessel'd. There's no changing of the guard at the management level, they don't need to shake things up that much. They want a good haul for the guy, why on earth would they trade a guy who consistently makes Team Canada for a bust of a 2nd overall?? Why don't you go and trade Jones for Yakupov or bring Daigle back if you think that's such a good idea? If they want a guy of Murray's caliber then they can sign Franson or practically any other ufa defenseman.

The guy is being totally Kessel'd. There's no changing of the guard at the management level, they don't need to shake things up that much. They want a good haul for the guy, why on earth would they trade a guy who consistently makes Team Canada for a bust of a 2nd overall?? Why don't you go and trade Jones for Yakupov or bring Daigle back if you think that's such a good idea? If they want a guy of Murray's caliber then they can sign Franson or practically any other ufa defenseman.
- mgriffen

He sort of is, however Avs media coverage arent railroading Duchene or the Avs for this, they are being very supportive in their coverage and respectful of the process not leaking sources.

Its the other teams media guys who seem to be talking the most crap and slinging the most garbage. Isnt the first time a team would use the media to try to drum up public pressure.

He sort of is, however Avs media coverage arent railroading Duchene or the Avs for this, they are being very supportive in their coverage and respectful of the process not leaking sources.

Its the other teams media guys who seem to be talking the most crap and slinging the most garbage. Isnt the first time a team would use the media to try to drum up public pressure.
- DDM-Coga

Not sure that is the case if you're talking about the dispatch or other local media , if anything, sportsnet and tsn (third party Canadian media ) have been somewhat pushing the envelope on this situation/trade bait whatever you want to call it.

He sort of is, however Avs media coverage arent railroading Duchene or the Avs for this, they are being very supportive in their coverage and respectful of the process not leaking sources.

Its the other teams media guys who seem to be talking the most crap and slinging the most garbage. Isnt the first time a team would use the media to try to drum up public pressure.
- DDM-Coga

Well I guess that's the difference between playing for Toronto and playing for just about anywhere else...

Not sure that is the case if you're talking about the dispatch or other local media , if anything, sportsnet and tsn (third party Canadian media ) have been somewhat pushing the envelope on this situation/trade bait whatever you want to call it.
- Alexzanki

Leafs drama is running dry, they need content.

Not sure that is the case if you're talking about the dispatch or other local media , if anything, sportsnet and tsn (third party Canadian media ) have been somewhat pushing the envelope on this situation/trade bait whatever you want to call it.
- Alexzanki

The islanders and somewhat the pens media guys have been tossing a lot of misinformation out and he said she said stuff. Havent really saw much from Portz in terms of trade talks, hes a pros pro

Well I guess that's the difference between playing for Toronto and playing for just about anywhere else...
- mgriffen

Duchene is a very respected guy, same as Joe, so they arent going to run their names into the mud for stories.

Dater has been really good about this, he has said he has heard about whats going on in the Talks and not to worry Avs fans, have faith in Joe...hes leaving it as that and wont say what is being offered whats not being offered.

Should have traded that pick and moved up and drafted Nail Yakupov

Who cares what Joe Sakic thinks?

In tonight's class we'll be learning about how to run a franchise into the ground with guest speaker Joe Sakic.

The year before Sakic was officially named GM Colorado finished first in the division with 112 points. The next 3?

14-15: 90 (last in division)
15-16: 82 (2nd to last in division)
16-17: 48 (last in everything)

So, again, why does anybody care what Joe Sakic thinks? Let him keep Duchene and we'll keep our "fifth" defenseman lol.

A guy who played like a 3rd pairing dman for a guy who played like a 3rd line forward......seems fair to me.

Sakic isn't in a position to criticize other players or GMs when he's asking for a kings ransom for a guy who had 18 goals and 40 points.

Is duchene better than last year's numbers suggest.......sure.....but so is Murray

I fail to see how Murray is a 5th Dman on a team that has poop Dmen. You dont even need to dig into the stats. Colorado was by far the worst in the league last season, Defence has clearly been an issue. If that is an issue then clearly your top 4 are not top 4 Dmen. Zadorov and Barberio are also NOT better than Murray. I know +/- is not a good stat to judge off of but where there is smoke there is fire. Zadorov has been a minus player in both the AHL and NHL. Barberio has been an NHL journeyman. At 27 years old he has failed to keep a job on a good NHL team. Habs put the guy on waivers last season, clearly losing him wasnt considered a big deal to the Habs.

Yes Murray played a lower role for Columbus but Columbus has a good strong Dcore that forced him down there. Murray was still a 2nd overall pick and is still 23 to boot. I know Seth Jones was a bit younger but he played as a 5th Dman on Nashville at one point and now he anchors the Jackets top D pair.

Sakic thinks like a player and not as a Manager. Sakic should have handled this situation a lot better.

Anisimov + Debrincat + 1st for Murray + Jenner

Anyone else remember the Hall for Larsson deal? Oilers received less than what was anticipated but the Oilers got exactly what they needed and Larsson was one of the guys who helped make Edmonton a playoff team, Talbot was another. People might say McDavid but even if he was healthy the season before, they still would have missed the playoffs.